Hi guys, just wanted some input before i release a beta mission named "Xieng Xeu"within the next few days...
First, i made yet another large terrain with jungles, ricefields, and a small village. My question is, 8 players or 10 in the COOP mode???
Next, CTF i will add since it is so easy to add...
Third, Death Match or Team Death Match on a very large map like this? Wouldn't that be a waste considering you would have to travel long distances to find the other player(s)?
The mission is Search and Destroy, Kill all enemy VC, and i haven't came up with a mission name as of yet, but i will find one i am sure...
When i get home i will get pictures/screens of the "map immersion" and post them here...but i need some feedback on the previous questions i am asking...
I voted 10 players but if it is larga map, i'm voting 12 players.
CTF with modified Ando's script. Also you can add another modes (ATG, ATGCOOP...)
DM and TDM, I think it is not problem to add both of them, just one more script.
If you will use for example area around village for DM, it will be fine. There is not necessary to fight at all map. For my DeathValley I'm using for CTF only VC base, not whole forrest.
Operation Shenandoah?
BTW please don't forget to add Ando's bleeding/killing feature
Hi,
I cant wait to see your map , i also vote for 12 players
And it would be nice if the other players who like to play other modes than Coop also can enjoy your work dont you think ? For CTF you should think about a max distance like you have in stream , also for DM or a bit smaller than that i hope you can understand why.
For me you dont have to add the bleeding system but its your map
SB - you can limit number of coop players by server setting but if it is big map and your team is bigger, there you cannot add players if it is limited by map. So 12 slots is not problem if you have 8 players in team but 8 slots is problem if your team has 12 players.
Silent Bob wrote:
I´d go for 8 players and custom spawn points like in DamnhaPhu or the bridge conversion of VC2 for the coop mode.
Also i´d personally prefer the DM features Kermit did in NioGhian (different locations all over the map as battle zones)
You rather have them and dont need them than you need them and you dont have the slots but besides that the spawnpoints would be very nice or just reset the game if everybody is dead and different locations for different gamemodes would be nice if the map is hugh i guess.
it comes in quite handy to have a high number of possible players when you have a full server and switch to the map you dont want to loose them players.
KostiCZ wrote:
I voted 10 players but if it is large map, i'm voting 12 players.
Having more players limits the amount of attacking VC, unless i use my respawn script, but i don't want AI to suddenly appear in front of anyone playing (unrealistic). I'll max Coop players to 10, so we can battle 52 AI.
KostiCZ wrote:
CTF with modified Ando's script. Also you can add another modes (ATG, ATGCOOP...)
No offense, but what does Ando's modified CTF script do for CTF? Also, i have never played ATG or ATGCOOP, are there players still filling servers for these game-modes?
KostiCZ wrote:
DM and TDM, I think it is not problem to add both of them, just one more script.
Because of the size, i really don't think this will work. Besides, if i want to place weapons and ammo at spawn area for players to "pick up" then i think all of the DM and TDM weapons and ammo will be lying around throughout the map (according to the script used). Not sure, you might have to expand on this for me, i have been away for a bit and can't remember if that is what will happen...
I would definately like to use bleeding script, i will have to send Ando a private message and work with him to get that implemented...Thx Kosti for your ideas and suggestions...and please don't take anything i said personal, as you know i am trying to better the mission for all of us to enjoy...Rich (Chavez_US)
DSOP-Apache wrote:
Hi, I cant wait to see your map , i also vote for 12 players
Thank you for reply DSOP-Apache, i think i'll max at 10 so we have a few more AI in the mix...
DSOP-Apache wrote:
And it would be nice if the other players who like to play other modes than Coop also can enjoy your work don't you think ? For CTF you should think about a max distance like you have in stream , also for DM or a bit smaller than that i hope you can understand why.
I definately would like other players to enjoy the terrain in other modes. However, over the last several weekends i only see players in CTF, COOP, and some TDM...Also, im not sure what the scene visibility is for Stream, my current setting is 160 meters, and my frame rates are in the mid 20's on my piece of s&@t Dell Dimension...
Thx DSOP-Apache for your ideas and suggestions...and please don't take anything i said personal, as you know i am trying to better the mission for all of us to enjoy...Rich (Chavez_US)
Silent Bob wrote:
I´d go for 8 players and custom spawn points like in DamnhaPhu or the bridge conversion of VC2 for the coop mode.
Also i´d personally prefer the DM features Kermit did in NioGhian (different locations all over the map as battle zones)
Hi Bob, and thank you for the reply. I already have 8 players, but am strongly considering 10 after the replies i have received already in this thread. I have seen plenty of 10 player Coop maps, and if the server is full i wouldn't want anyone to get dropped while playing the glorious game of Vietcong Also, i will have to use total commander and take a look at Kermits map to see how he set that up...
Thx Bob for your ideas and suggestions...and please don't take anything i said personal, as you know i am trying to better the mission for all of us to enjoy...Rich (Chavez_US)
Confused Master wrote:
It comes in quite handy to have a high number of possible players when you have a full server and switch to the map you dont want to loose players.
Thank you for reply Confused Master, I totally agree, i hate it when i get dropped (because of my location in the US versus EU) and other players load in quicker than I,...then i have to refresh game servers and wait until there is a map with a larger amount of player slots to join in.
Well, thank you for the replies and ideas gentlemen, i ran through it last night with one VC, and he chased me throughout the map. Numerous times he ran for cover and dove behind logs, rocks, and areas of the terrain. Unfortunately i didn't upload the screens i promised. I will do that today when i get home (heard that one before?, lol). If i were to add those extra modes it will delay the release of the mission, and may cause server instability (crashes). I may need some help from anyone who has implemeted these game modes in their maps/missions(without any server crashes). You would just have to focus on the script and placement of respawn points, i've pretty much dont most of the hard work already (over the last 2 months). I can upload my level file if that is the case. Sound good? Rich (Chavez_US)
Xieng Xeu Village
It is rumored Laos has been harboring enemy VC guerillas in the caves and valleys of Northeastern Laos. Intel has discovered a small, fortified place local villager’s call “Xieng Xeu,” located in the Houaphanh Province. It is surrounded by large limestone mountains, and rice fields near the Nam Neua River. You, and your elite special-forces team, will parachute, in darkness, to your target landing zone at 0500 hours. At dawn you will regroup with your team to complete your mission. Your mission is to take out all enemy forces in this remote area. Take no prisoners, all enemy forces must die…
Current game modes:
US COOP - 10 vs. 52 AI
CTF - 20 US vs. 20 VC
Chavez_US wrote: Hi guys, just wanted some input before i release a beta within the next few days...
Over the past few years I have suggested here a number of small changes (well-defined but discrete single features) to be added to already-established large maps, maps which are commonly played on the Black Pajamas Homi server.
Chavez_US wrote: Hi guys, just wanted some input before i release a beta within the next few days...
Over the past few years I have suggested here a number of small changes (well-defined but discrete single features) to be added to already-established large maps, ...
What small changes would those be RiskyDingo? And thx for the reply as well
Chavez_US wrote: Hi guys, just wanted some input before i release a beta within the next few days...
Over the past few years I have suggested here a number of small changes (well-defined but discrete single features) to be added to already-established large maps, maps which are commonly played on the Black Pajamas Homi server.
But so far, no takers.
This count as input?
A lot of people suggested some changes but most of them are not applicable on existing game engine. Can you be more concrete about your ideas? I don't remember what exactly do you mean.
Not yet, about to be cooked. Nice open terrain. The only thing that came to my mind was maybe a bit more opportunities for the team to cover. Means some more rocks and other solid small things to maybe have an effect on the variety of tactics and movements to approach the different fire-fights?
DSOP-Apache wrote: Can we download this mission already ?
I will have Xieng Xeu_beta_01 ready by the weekend for (10)Coop and (40)CTF players.
Curandero wrote: Nice open terrain. The only thing that came to my mind was maybe a bit more opportunities for the team to cover. Means some more rocks and other solid small things to maybe have an effect on the variety of tactics and movements to approach the different fire-fights? Very good stuff, as usual. Keep it up!
Thx Curandero, i am trying to avoid too many objetcs due to the size of the terrain, this happened to me with another large terrain, where i had 2000 rocks, 4600 grass, 450 logs, 1600 trees,...then the editor began to crash and i had to use the backup.sco's to get the map to load into the editor again,...but, i will try to add more, to give more opportunity for angles of attack and strategy. Thank you Curandero for reply.
what about to reduce grass and use grow objects (grass) instead of it? I think you can delete for example 1500 grass objects and use grow randomly placed between real grass... I hope you understand what I mean
Chavez_US wrote:
...i am trying to avoid too many objetcs due to the size of the terrain, this happened to me with another large terrain, where i had 2000 rocks, 4600 grass, 450 logs, 1600 trees,...then the editor began to crash and i had to use the backup.sco's to get the map to load into the editor again,..
Indeed, It seems that there is a limit for each "object"... For example, I have found that the limit of the "kolizepomocna" (invisible walls) object is 160. If we go up, it won't work anymore...
Maybe I'm wrong but I see we may have some "gaming problem" with your map, Chavez_US. I explain you "why" I'm thinking "this"...
VET's bots have always been very good killers and the map is rather very dark... However, with a scene view distance of 160 meters (wich is a lot), they will have plenty of time to see and kill us (if you don't set it in their scripts) before we can even spot or hear them shooting (?). My advise would be to decrease the scene view distance to at least 100 meters, or even more (70 or 80 meters).
But with such a shorter distance (that will help the fps anyway), I guess that the trees and the hills (mainly) will start to "appear" badly... For me, the best (but harder work) to avoid that, would be to edit your sky with a kind of "fake fog" at the bottom of the textures. I agree, it won't be evident to find the "right colour" (and height) for such a "night fog" that will help you to have smooth transitions between your objects, the fog and the sky by still keeping the original effect you wanted!
You can see how to create that effect by reading this "how to"...
Note:
It's just a suggestion based on my very first "feelings"... Keep your original idea if you feel I'm wrong because you're the only one to have played the map yet!
KostiCZ wrote:
what about to reduce grass and use grow objects (grass) instead of it? I think you can delete for example 1500 grass objects and use grow randomly placed between real grass... I hope you understand what I mean
I created 10m x 10m grass squares which have a clip distance of 80M each, and these are spread throughout the "low" areas marshes of the terrain. I did think of using grow.dat files, but most of the time i spend ALOT of time trying to fix things sticking out of rocks and logs...too time consuming for a large terrain...There is a possibility i could re-wrap a texture of the same type in specific areas of the map and assign a grow.dat letter to it though...we will see what you think of beta first, then i will take more suggestions on fixing/replacing things...Thx KostiCZ
Intruder wrote:
VET's bots have always been very good killers and the map is rather very dark... However, with a scene view distance of 160 meters (wich is a lot), they will have plenty of time to see and kill us (if you don't set it in their scripts) before we can even spot or hear them shooting (?). My advise would be to decrease the scene view distance to at least 100 meters, or even more (70 or 80 meters).
But with such a shorter distance (that will help the fps anyway), I guess that the trees and the hills (mainly) will start to "appear" badly... For me, the best (but harder work) to avoid that, would be to edit your sky with a kind of "fake fog" at the bottom of the textures. I agree, it won't be evident to find the "right colour" (and height) for such a "night fog" that will help you to have smooth transitions between your objects, the fog and the sky by still keeping the original effect you wanted!
Intruder
I have since changed the scene visibility to 100M, as of last night. I tried to change the terrain to scene no cut visibility, so I would have the limestone mountians i created around the terrain constantly show, but when i do this, it makes my stream IFL texture disappear. I am not sure why this happens. But, i will review your sticky on this again...I am using default scripts to avoid any server crashes. The scene and fog coloration is for early morning assault, so i can't make it too bright. I did this because the grass i made is darker, and also the terrain has objects on it which cause errors for LM's. And running LMs would increase the size DL for all of us. Shadowing does look awesome though, but for this map it would be a huge file...Thank you for the suggestion Intruder, i will look into your link when i get home...
...I tried to change the terrain to scene no cut visibility, so I would have the limestone mountians i created around the terrain constantly show,...
I was almost sure it was for a reason of this kind you wanted a higher scene view distance...
The scene and fog coloration is for early morning assault, so i can't make it too bright.
If it's done "the right way" I really believe you could have a nice result but as I already suggested, it could be a very long and boring work to do before to find THE right effect! I'm first thinking about a dark gray fog with a tint of blue but I'm not sure about the final result of course! lol
I did this because the grass i made is darker,
Normally, it shouldn't be a problem to find the good "light" of your grass, even if the grass is darker. Have you tried this "how to" yet? If yes, the link can be useful for "others" too anyway...
...and also the terrain has objects on it which cause errors for LM's. And running LMs would increase the size DL for all of us. Shadowing does look awesome though, but for this map it would be a huge file...
The solution Pterodon used when they faced the same problem was to create a "fake texture" on wich they painted the shadows (NVABase and NuiPek maps use such textures)... That texture is then applied on the whole terrain and gives very good results in my opinion. Maybe you should try?
I'm planning to add such a texture myself on my Intrusion map to add much more details in the "visuals" of the terrain...
I worked on scene visibility last night, and also added more cover (rocks/logs, trees). The only thing left for me to do is place AI and assign scripts. I have alread placed and linked over 2300 waypoints. @Intruder, I read your tutorials, and decided to go with 80M visibility, and fog distance set at Near:1, and Far: 79 (per your tutorial). Also in further reading through your tutorials, i was going to "slightly" modify the AI settings (i.e. boldness = 5), but which .inc file is it, and where is it located (its been a while )
I will have the beta ready for download for ALL tomorrow morning (Saturday). Then i will be open to suggestions once again.
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Also, i will have to use total commander and take a look at Kermits map to see how he set that up...
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